[Date Prev][Date Next][Thread Prev][Thread Next][Date Index][Thread Index]
Re: [IRCA] TP 19 Oct, Victoria version
- Subject: Re: [IRCA] TP 19 Oct, Victoria version
- From: d1028gary@xxxxxxx
- Date: Sun, 20 Oct 2013 22:00:54 -0400 (EDT)
<<< If you're using the FSLs and ultralights only Gary, I wonder if they
are not quite up to the weak signals some time after sunrise? >>>
Well, there's certainly no doubt that a 7" FSL (like Colin has, with a coil diameter x ferrite length "Point Score" of 980) is never going to compete with your FLG-100 antenna in TP-DXing. Likewise, neither the ICF-2010 nor the PL-380 is ever going to compete with the NetSDR, the Perseus or the R-8 in sensitivity, or in narrow filtering. All of the DXers who use such portables understand this, and have come to terms with the fact that their basic equipment makes the chase of exotic DX more challenging. As such, even if I can't hear the NHK2 sign off chimes here in Puyallup, it won't ruin my day :-)
The primary advantage of the FSL + PL-380 combination is the ability to "go where no DXer has gone before," and set up at some very bizarre locations like narrow ocean side cliffs. The small footprint of the FSL and the $50 (almost expendable :-) cost of the PL-380 makes it easy to set up in risky venues to investigate ocean cliff propagation. When they do tap into an ocean cliff propagation boost, the combo suddenly becomes pretty competitive with state-of-the-art equipment at sea level, at least on their one frequency of choice. The 12" FSL that I'm using here (with a "Point Score" of 2400) also seems to provide enough TP-DXing sensitivity to keep things interesting even here in Puyallup, in combination with the basic PL-380 receiver.
73, Gary
-----Original Message-----
From: Nick Hall-Patch <nhp@xxxxxxxx>
To: Mailing list for the International Radio Club of America <irca@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Sun, Oct 20, 2013 4:42 pm
Subject: Re: [IRCA] TP 19 Oct, Victoria version
If you're using the FSLs and ultralights only Gary, I wonder if they
are not quite up to the weak signals some time after sunrise?
Yesterday I borrowed Colin Newell's FSL and was getting poor audio
this morning on 774 pre-sunrise using it with the ICF-2010. However,
plugging the output from the FLG-100 into the 2010's antenna input
brought 774 solidly into readability. (the 774 signal level was
about the same when each antenna was tested, per the DXFishbarrel's
signal strength display) So I wonder if we're talking about the
relative merits of antennas here? The FLG100 also nulls both Calgary
and Seattle which can't hurt. I didn't try for the post sunrise
signals using the 2010, but it is not as sensitive a radio as the
NetSDR or R-8, so that might make a difference also.
best wishes,
Nick
At 20:07 20-10-13, you wrote:
>Hi Nick,
>
>This morning (10-20) the Asians packed it in around 1500 here, by
>which time the last die-hards (594-JOAK and 972-HLCA) were finally
>inaudible. They still had some weak heterodynes, though.
>
>Because of the watered down sunrise enhancements at this lackluster
>location the NHK2 sign-off chimes have never been heard here in 7
>years of TP-DXing. It seems like the surrounding hills cut Asian
>propagation short by some unknown science-- which is at least better
>than how the same hills ruin the DU propagation completely. The
>almost total absence of DU-DX here is a powerful motivator for
>building huge FSL's to "turn the tables" in South Pacific DXing on
>the Oregon cliffs each summer.
>
>73, Gary
>
>
>
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Nick Hall-Patch <nhp@xxxxxxxx>
>To: Mailing list for the International Radio Club of America
><irca@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>Sent: Sun, Oct 20, 2013 11:29 am
>Subject: Re: [IRCA] TP 19 Oct, Victoria version
>
>
>Sounds like the location may have something to do with it, Gary,
>unless you heard something like both Dennis and I did today. I'll
>need to move my tuned loop outside away from my own electrical noise
>to get a better picture, but it was underperforming this morning on
>the late DX.
>
>NHK2 signed off at 1515UT today, a pity because both 747 and 774
>carriers were quite strong later.
>
>best wishes,
>
>Nick
>
>
>
>At 05:22 20-10-13, you wrote:
>
>
> ><<< How late did you listen today? I'm curious as to whether maybe the
> >ferrite monster is responsive to lower arrival angles than maybe the
> >Flag is. >>>
> >
> >Well, this morning I gave a final check at 1500UT, but even the big
> >guns like 774-JOUB and 972-HLCA were already inaudible down in the
> >noise. It felt lucky to even have them around until 1450 (especially
> >after this miserable week), so I'm not complaining.
> >
> >Anyway, the evidence would strongly indicate that this mediocre
> >location (surrounded by hills to the north, east and south, and the
> >Olympic mountains to the west) is responsible for the watered-down
> >sunrise enhancements, and not the FSL antenna's DX arrival angle.
> >The same lackluster sunrise enhancement was observed with the 9' air
> >core box loops used here from 2009-2010. I was amazed at how you and
> >Nick would hear the NHK2 sign off chimes almost every day around
> >December during those years, when I never even knew what they were
> >:-) In fact, I never even heard the NHK2 sign off chimes until I
> >made an ill-advised DXpedition to the Rockwork 4 ocean cliff last
> >November (during a vicious windstorm).
> >
> >73, Gary
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >-----Original Message-----
> >From: Nick Hall-Patch <nhp@xxxxxxxx>
> >To: Mailing list for the International Radio Club of America
> ><irca@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> >Sent: Sat, Oct 19, 2013 9:05 pm
> >Subject: Re: [IRCA] TP 19 Oct, Victoria version
> >
> >
> >I don't know Gary. What salt water is nearby might help a bit for
> >New Zealand, and maybe Australia, but the path from Asia is over the
> >rocky spine of Vancouver Island, hence you and Bruce hearing Chinese
> >that I rarely hear. I suspect that this morning's good (and
> >fleeting) signals might have been due to an anomalous high angle of
> >arrival, which would be less affected by our local rockpile.
> >
> >How late did you listen today? I'm curious as to whether maybe the
> >ferrite monster is responsive to lower arrival angles than maybe
> the Flag is.
> >
> >best wishes,
> >
> >Nick
> >
> >
> >At 00:37 20-10-13, you wrote:
> >
> > >Hi Nick,
> > >
> > ><<< 972 HLCA caught a similar time to Gary's recording, almost operatic
> > >vocal ballad 1357UT; but the kicker was 1424UT man and woman talking
> > >then KK male ballad, mashing the splatter into
> > >oblivion:
> > >http://www3.telus.net/public/shallpat/listen/HLCA_20131019_1424.wav
> > >(not fair; synchronous demodulation, FLG100 antenna) Still pretty
> > >fair at times around 1530UT (local sunrise about 45 minutes
> earlier). >>>
> > >
> > >Thanks for posting your 972-HLCA recording from this morning-- and
> > >it's certainly an impressive signal on your FLG100.
> > >
> > >Your location near salt water seems to make a big difference in the
> > >duration of sunrise enhancement on mornings like these, and I'm
> > >always amazed at how long the big gun TP's can keep their signals
> > >going for you and Walt (and also for Dennis, in Kalama). Here in
> > >Puyallup there is a very watered-down version of sunrise
> > >enhancement, with all the Asians biting the dust about an hour earlier.
> > >
> > >73, Gary
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >-----Original Message-----
> > >From: Nick Hall-Patch <nhp@xxxxxxxx>
> > >To: Mailing list for the International Radio Club of America
> > ><irca@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> > >Sent: Sat, Oct 19, 2013 11:03 am
> > >Subject: [IRCA] TP 19 Oct, Victoria version
> > >
> > >
> > >Gary's already checked in, and yes, it was a better morning, plus
> > >lots of unID carriers, and lasted a long time too. Snippets of audio
> > >up until 1545UT or so. But conditions were still up and down, not
> > >being able to find a parallel for 828 a half hour before local
> > >sunrise isn't ideal.
> > >
> > >pretty darn good audio (all of it understandable by a native speaker,
> > >at least briefly):
> > >
> > >774 JOUB man in JJ 1352UT
> > >972 HLCA caught a similar time to Gary's recording, almost operatic
> > >vocal ballad 1357UT; but the kicker was 1424UT man and woman talking
> > >then KK male ballad, mashing the splatter into
> > >oblivion:
> > >http://www3.telus.net/public/shallpat/listen/HLCA_20131019_1424.wav
> > >(not fair; synchronous demodulation, FLG100 antenna) Still pretty
> > >fair at times around 1530UT (local sunrise about 45 minutes earlier).
> > >
> > >
> > >Reasonable audio at times during the period (much of it
> > >understandable by a native speaker, though often battling w/splash
> > or noise):
> > >
> > >
> > >567 JOIK man in JJ 1420UT, no 594 for parallel right now
> > >594 JOAK man and woman in JJ 1355UT
> > >828 JOBB man in JJ 1416UT, with no parallels available. Still no
> > >parallels at 1532UT with similar strength, woman in JJ, but soon faded.
> > >963 CRI female vocal ballad 1426UT, then woman talking //1323
> > >1053 KK jammer 1323UT
> > >1323 CRI female ballad 1437UT //963; still weakly ballading at 1530UT
> > >1566 HLAZ woman then man in CC 1356UT
> > >1575 VoA man and woman SE Asian language 1439UT
> > >
> > >
> > >not so reasonable audio, occasional words or phrases in splash or
> > >noise could be understood by a native speaker:
> > >
> > >747 JOIB man in JJ 1401UT //774
> > >945 CNR1 man in CC 1425UT slightly offset from 6030// making a
> > >strange echo; actually slightly better strength at 1430UT upon
> > >playing back the recording.
> > >1017 CRI male vocal //5965 1428UT; apparently still there 1539UT w/KK
> > >sounding talk by man, but very weak
> > >1287 JOHR man and woman in JJ 1414UT
> > >
> > >Burbles in the splatter and noise (if lucky, language might be
> > >guessed at by cadence of talk, or parallel established by changes in
> > >talk or music) :
> > >
> > >558 unID man talking quietly, more a KK sound? 1423UT; never got
> > 603 in audio
> > >855 unID man talking and hum 1405UT, but no SW parallels available
> > >(too much noise)
> > >873 JOGB likely 1320UT, with woman talking...easy to imagine she said
> > >"JOGB" just at 1320, but too weak to be sure. //747 a couple of
> > >minutes later, but tough listening.
> > >981 CNR1 little news sounder? coming through //945 1431UT, but 945
> > >seemed to have news after low and high pip on the half hour
> > >1206 Yanbian? man talking, KK inflection, off channel 1347UT
> > >1242 JOLF? rock mx 1402UT, only caught last pip on hour, and too weak
> > >to tell if it had the "cuckoo" sound
> > >
> > >
> > >Strongish het, no or "near imaginary"audio (either undermodulated or
> > >ravaged by splatter):
> > >
> > >603 621 648 711 756 837 864 918 936 1035 1044 1134 1278 1476
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >best wishes,
> > >
> > >Nick
> > >
> > >_______________________________________________
> > >IRCA mailing list
> > >IRCA@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > >http://montreal.kotalampi.com/mailman/listinfo/irca
> > >
> > >Opinions expressed in messages on this mailing list are those of
> > the original
> > >contributors and do not necessarily reflect the opinion of the IRCA, its
> > >editors, publishing staff, or officers
> > >
> > >For more information: http://www.ircaonline.org
> > >
> > >To Post a message: irca@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >_______________________________________________
> > >IRCA mailing list
> > >IRCA@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > >http://montreal.kotalampi.com/mailman/listinfo/irca
> > >
> > >Opinions expressed in messages on this mailing list are those of the
> > >original contributors and do not necessarily reflect the opinion of
> > >the IRCA, its editors, publishing staff, or officers
> > >
> > >For more information: http://www.ircaonline.org
> > >
> > >To Post a message: irca@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> >
> >
> >_______________________________________________
> >IRCA mailing list
> >IRCA@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> >http://montreal.kotalampi.com/mailman/listinfo/irca
> >
> >Opinions expressed in messages on this mailing list are those of
> the original
> >contributors and do not necessarily reflect the opinion of the IRCA, its
> >editors, publishing staff, or officers
> >
> >For more information: http://www.ircaonline.org
> >
> >To Post a message: irca@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> >
> >
> >
> >_______________________________________________
> >IRCA mailing list
> >IRCA@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> >http://montreal.kotalampi.com/mailman/listinfo/irca
> >
> >Opinions expressed in messages on this mailing list are those of the
> >original contributors and do not necessarily reflect the opinion of
> >the IRCA, its editors, publishing staff, or officers
> >
> >For more information: http://www.ircaonline.org
> >
> >To Post a message: irca@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>
>
>_______________________________________________
>IRCA mailing list
>IRCA@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>http://montreal.kotalampi.com/mailman/listinfo/irca
>
>Opinions expressed in messages on this mailing list are those of the original
>contributors and do not necessarily reflect the opinion of the IRCA, its
>editors, publishing staff, or officers
>
>For more information: http://www.ircaonline.org
>
>To Post a message: irca@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>
>
>
>
>_______________________________________________
>IRCA mailing list
>IRCA@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>http://montreal.kotalampi.com/mailman/listinfo/irca
>
>Opinions expressed in messages on this mailing list are those of the
>original contributors and do not necessarily reflect the opinion of
>the IRCA, its editors, publishing staff, or officers
>
>For more information: http://www.ircaonline.org
>
>To Post a message: irca@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
_______________________________________________
IRCA mailing list
IRCA@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
http://montreal.kotalampi.com/mailman/listinfo/irca
Opinions expressed in messages on this mailing list are those of the original
contributors and do not necessarily reflect the opinion of the IRCA, its
editors, publishing staff, or officers
For more information: http://www.ircaonline.org
To Post a message: irca@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
_______________________________________________
IRCA mailing list
IRCA@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
http://montreal.kotalampi.com/mailman/listinfo/irca
Opinions expressed in messages on this mailing list are those of the original contributors and do not necessarily reflect the opinion of the IRCA, its editors, publishing staff, or officers
For more information: http://www.ircaonline.org
To Post a message: irca@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx