Re: [IRCA] DKAZ questions

["Paul B. Walker, Jr." <walkerbroadcasting@xxxxxxxxx>]

If you're reallllllllyyy close to fm transmitters, as I am, it can affect
the SW band. I haven't done much AM DX here but haven't noticed the FMs
overloading into Am but haven't looked too closely

Paul

On Friday, October 7, 2016, Russ Edmunds <wb2bjh@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:

> The two FM's really shouldn't impact your AM DX, so your problems seem to
> begin and end with WCMR and the radiated noise.
>
> Russ Edmunds
> 15 mi NW Phila
> Grid FN20id
> <wb2bjh@xxxxxxxxx <javascript:;>>
>
> AM: Modified Sony ICF2010's (4) barefoot w/whip
> FM: Yamaha T-80 & T-85, each w/ Conrad RDS Decoder;
> Onkyo T-450RDS; Tecsun PL-310 ( 4);
> modified Sony ICF2010's (3) w/APS9B @ 15';
> modified Sony ICF2010 w/whip
>
>
> On Fri, Oct 7, 2016 at 12:20 PM, Mark Pettifor <mark@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> <javascript:;>> wrote:
>
> > Lots of useful info - thanks to all! I think it would also be useful to
> > tell you about my RF situation here in the Land of Goshen to get the best
> > advice.
> >
> > 1. I live less than two miles from 3 transmitters:
> >
> > -- WCMR 1270 AM. They are 5kW day, 1kW night. Bearing: NNW
> > -- WFRN 104.7 FM. 50kW. Same site as WCMR.
> > -- WSSM 97.7 FM. 6kW. Bearing: NNE
> >
> > I usually have to switch on attenuation for the ELAD via software (and
> for
> > any other radio, really) when using my SE-NW longwire, which is about 150
> > feet long. The rest are OK without attenuation. That's a lot of RF flying
> > about though. Growing up, we used to hear WCMR in all kinds of odd
> > situations - sometimes just an improperly-grounded audio circuit would
> pick
> > them up. I swear I heard their audio once coming from the heater vents
> from
> > the furnace...
> >
> > 2. There's a local RF noise source from somewhere - I think it's the
> > neighbor across the road, using some kind of battery charger on the RV
> > parked in their drive. We've talked briefly before, but I really need to
> > take the time to get with him and identify the problem, and offer to help
> > replace equipment or whatever it takes. It's pretty bad. Sometimes it
> even
> > covers up the Detroit Tigers game on Kalamazoo's WKZO on 590, which
> upsets
> > both myself and my brother, who lives next door. :^)
> >
> > Whatever the interference is, gets sent out the power lines from the
> > neighbor's house, to the power pole. That section of power line is above
> > ground, so it radiates the noise locally to whatever will receive it.
> What
> > receives it best is MY power line coming to the house from the same pole,
> > which is also above ground. So I've got "dirty" power coming into the
> > house, as well as power lines transmitting it to the surrounding area. To
> > get away from all that noise, I have to have the antenna about 100 feet
> > away from the house, on the opposite side from the road. Anything closer
> > gets saturated with noise.
> >
> > Best solution is to identify the noise and eliminate it. The neighbors
> are
> > nice people - I think I can get him to help narrow it down. Perhaps
> another
> > solution would be to see if the power company will bury the power lines
> for
> > both of us. It would involve going under the road though - the pole is on
> > my side of the road.
> >
> > As I get older, I'm finding myself more willing to spend the money for
> > "plug n play" solutions, but still, it's fun tinkering and rolling your
> > own. Just a matter of time for me mostly right now - there are some other
> > big time-consuming projects I need to address.
> >
> > Thanks for all the feedback! (If this were an audio forum, that would've
> > been a pun...)
> >
> > Mark
> >
> > On 2016-10-07 11:25 am, Neil Kazaross wrote:
> >
> >> Unless one has some parts and wants to tinker, by far the easiest
> solution
> >> is go with a FLG100 from Wellbrook and a Vactrol from Colin. Both plug
> and
> >> play with cables and BNC connectors.
> >>
> >> 73 KAZ
> >>
> >> On Fri, Oct 7, 2016 at 9:52 AM, Nick Hall-Patch <nhp@xxxxxxxx
> <javascript:;>> wrote:
> >>
> >> Thanks Mark.   I do think that your points about twisted pair are
> correct,
> >>> and it would be intriguing to see if using twisted pair with the FLG100
> >>> would make any further difference to the noise pickup.   My suspicion
> is
> >>> not, but it's only a suspicion.    One of the things one seems to be
> >>> paying
> >>> for with the FLG100, as with the ALA100, is eliminating the concerns
> >>> about
> >>> noise being conveyed on the coax shield, which is what a balanced pair
> >>> will
> >>> do for you as well, at lower cost.
> >>>
> >>> The difference for me has been the "out of the box" nature of the
> FLG100
> >>> solution.  There are costs and costs, and time has been a big one of
> them
> >>> in my years as a DXer.    And once the FLG100 is up, there's been no
> >>> tinkering with connections.
> >>>
> >>> One thing that has made twisted pair not "out of the box" for me has
> been
> >>> the lack of remotely weatherproof connectors at a price that  is not at
> >>> least a down payment on a FLG100 (and yes, the BNC on the coax is not
> >>> totally weatherproof, but a few inches of rubber tape is pretty close).
> >>> If you have something that works well with CAT5 (banana plugs don't
> >>> count;
> >>> I've been troubleshooting with you, remember), then I am all ears.    I
> >>> think we discussed feed-through glands at one time.  Is that what you
> >>> have
> >>> in mind?
> >>>
> >>> best wishes,
> >>>
> >>> Nick
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> At 11:58 07-10-16, you wrote:
> >>>
> >>> I do love the way the varied interests in this hobby are propagated
> >>>> through this club from member to member and I'm grateful for the
> >>>> knowledge
> >>>> and experience that's so freely shared.
> >>>>
> >>>> One baby elephant in the room is Mark's antenna "ambience."  If his
> QTH
> >>>> there in the Land O' Goshen is in a field of electrical interference
> >>>> (and
> >>>> perhaps significant local RF?), the noise gathered by the lead-in may
> >>>> be an
> >>>> issue best resolved not by common-mode choking but by "balancing" the
> >>>> feed-lines.
> >>>>
> >>>> I've bored folks to death by espousing the balanced twisted-pair
> >>>> approach, in the form of Category cable (Cat 5, Cat5e etc) with an
> >>>> impedance around 110 ohms.  IMHO such a BALANCED transmission line
> >>>> pretty
> >>>> much eliminates stray pickup without the need for common-mode choking.
> >>>> Cat-5 sells for around $45/1000 feet...although if the budget allows,
> >>>> I'd
> >>>> go for STRANDED Cat-5.
> >>>>
> >>>> As I type this I'm watching the Perseus on a D-Kaz facing mostly west
> >>>> and
> >>>> watching Seattle rolling in, here in North-Central Minnesota.  Using a
> >>>> 9:1
> >>>> transformer and Cat-5 with a DXE RPA-1 in the shack and watching a
> noise
> >>>> floor of -111 dbm in 5 kHz, after the amplifier's 15 db gain.
> >>>>
> >>>> An absolute YES to the Vactrol approach for the null component.  The
> >>>> design for that circuit somewhat obviates the potential for stray
> >>>> common-mode pickup, so coax may work FB, but again...twisted-pair is
> so
> >>>> easy to implement.
> >>>>
> >>>> As to mounting the RF amplifier at the antenna:  I've tried the FLG
> and
> >>>> the DXE, planting them both at the antenna and in the shack.  Like Don
> >>>> Moman, I can't really find any significant improvement...though in
> >>>> theory
> >>>> antenna-mounting of the amplifier is the better approach; weathering
> >>>> issues
> >>>> notwithstanding.  (You would however, need a balancing transformer
> after
> >>>> the amplifier if you fed twisted-pair.)
> >>>>
> >>>> A winterized installation at my site would include twisted-pair
> >>>> lead-ins,
> >>>> a 9:1 transformer and a Vactrol control, mounted in weatherproof boxes
> >>>> and
> >>>> the amplifier in the nice warm shack.  Amazon fans have found all
> sizes
> >>>> of
> >>>> weatherproof boxes and wire feed-throughs:
> >>>>
> >>>> At Amazon's greedy query, type in: "Cable Connect Waterproof Plastic
> >>>> Case
> >>>> Junction Box" and "Plastic Waterproof Cable Connectors"
> >>>>
> >>>> Decent transformers (if you don't have strong RF nearby)
> >>>> http://www.minicircuits.com/pdfs/T9-1.pdf
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> Now for the famous YMMV  <g>   Have fun Mark; continue to share your
> >>>> experiences!
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> Mark Durenberger, CPBE
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> -----Original Message----- From: Mark Pettifor
> >>>>
> >>>> Thanks for the advice guys - much appreciated!
> >>>>
> >>>> I should also publicly thank Tim Tromp for getting me interested in
> the
> >>>> DKAZ to begin with.
> >>>> Mark
> >>>>
> >>>> On 2016-10-06 10:02 pm, Nick Hall-Patch wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>> Agreed.    They do cost a fair amount (mind you the exchange rate with
> >>>>> the pound isn't bad right now), but are solidly built and work very
> >>>>> well.
> >>>>> Money well spent.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>> Nick
> >>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> At 22:17 06-10-16, you wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>> I very strongly recommend the Wellbrook FLG100LN, They go right at
> the
> >>>>>> antenna and replace your xfmr. Now what is picked up by the antenna
> is
> >>>>>> amped 22 dB whereas what is picked up by the coax is not amped at
> all.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> I have two of these and they've survived IL weather for over 3
> years.
> >>>>>> 73
> >>>>>> KAZ Barrington IL
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> On Thu, Oct 6, 2016 at 4:29 PM, Mark Pettifor <mark@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> <javascript:;>>
> >>>>>> wrote:
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> > For those of you who have DKAZ antennas, which preamp do you use?
> Do
> >>>>>> > you
> >>>>>> > find it makes much difference whether you put it at the antenna or
> >>>>>> in
> >>>>>> > the
> >>>>>> > shack?
> >>>>>> >
> >>>>>> > I need to "finish" construction on mine. Right now, I have two
> >>>>>> 470-ohm
> >>>>>> > resistors alligator-clipped together for the null end, and a
> >>>>>> hand-wound
> >>>>>> > transformer (my first ever) on a core made of unknown material, to
> >>>>>> go
> >>>>>> > from
> >>>>>> > 940 to 50 into a 50-ohm feedline.... RG-8X, 150 feet. That is also
> >>>>>> > alligator-clipped together. It was for testing, ya know?  :^)
> >>>>>> >
> >>>>>> > It's been pretty good as is, but I want to get it ready to survive
> >>>>>> the
> >>>>>> > winter.
> >>>>>> >
> >>>>>> > BTW, it's amazing the amount of noise just a short length of RG-8X
> >>>>>> 100%
> >>>>>> > shielded coax will pick up. I have it mostly on the ground, but
> >>>>>> have a
> >>>>>> > small part of the run overhead for now (30 feet?) so I don't mow
> >>>>>> over
> >>>>>> > it.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>> > Thanks!
> >>>>
> >>>>> >
> >>>>>> > Mark Pettifor
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>> > Near Goshen, INdx.com
> >>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>>
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> >>>>
> >>> Nick Hall-Patch
> >>> Victoria, BC
> >>> Canada
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