Re: [IRCA] Ferrite Sleeve Loop (FSL)

[d1028gary@xxxxxxx]

Hello All,

Like Steve has summarized, there has been quite a bit of FSL
experimentation in the Ultralightdx Yahoo group, including multiple
models made by Steve, Kevin Schanilec, and me.

Although we all see the potential in the FSL design (especially in the
antenna's unique ability to provide high-gain signal boosts from a very
compact package), the FSL gets its performance edge from a large
concentration of ferrite bars, which are arranged in a cylindrical
sleeve-- with the associated side effects of relatively heavy weight,
and heavy expenditure of $$$. The most effective FSL's are the ones
with the most ferrite rods or bars in the cylindrical sleeve, and these
ferrite components do not come cheaply. The FSL experimenters in the
Ultralight group have attempted to cut costs by ordering ferrite rods
and bars from the Eastern European sellers of Russian surplus
components on eBay, but we have all been less trhan satisfied with the
results.

Despite all the challenges, the FSL's that we have constructed have
worked quite well in providing high gain inductive-coupling boosts to
Ultralight radios on both LW and MW frequencies, and Steve has been
especially successful in using his largest FSL antenna in actual
NDB-chasing with his PL-380 on the Longwave band (the latest DXing
craze in the Ultralight Radio group). If and when we are successful in
constructing larger-sized FSL's we will be happy to share the
experimental results with everyone.

73 and Good DX,
Gary DeBock (in Puyallup, WA, USA)

-----Original Message-----
From: Steve Ratzlaff <steveratz@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: Mailing list for the International Radio Club of America
<irca@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Sun, Apr 10, 2011 8:49 pm
Subject: Re: [IRCA] Ferrite Sleeve Loop (FSL)

Several of us on the Ultralight Radio (ULR) yahoo group have been
experimenting with FSLs for a couple of months now, after reading
Graham
Maynard's article. Most of the info we've learned has been discussed on
that
group.
I think it's safe to say that none of us buy the (hogwash) theories
espoused
by Graham Maynard, but the practical implementation does work for
making an
antenna out of a ferrite sleeve, though some of his claimed performance
details have yet to be duplicated by anyone else. And he is far from
the
first to try such an idea; others from years ago have already written
about
it, though his own ideas about how it works are strictly unique to him.
For a practical example, using a Tecsun PL-380 ULR and a FSL with LF
coil,
I've heard over 270 NDBs, listening indoors the past couple of months.
73,
Steve AA7U
NE Oregon

----- Original Message -----
From: "Tim Hills" <thills@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: "Mailing list for the International Radio Club of America"
<irca@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Sunday, April 10, 2011 7:57 PM
Subject: Re: [IRCA] (no subject)


> Hi Terry,
>
> I've seen designs using bundled rods before and his may very well
perform
> as described.
>
> But his "Theory" of how and why ferrite based antennas work?
>
> Before I was halfway through reading the link I had to get out my
tinfoil
> hat. I have to admit that citing Tesla, Moray and "free energy" sets
off a
> Kook alert for me so bear that in mind. He should read more of
Tesla's
> early writings when he was still honest enough to admit that he could
> design, build and use his devices he had no clue why they worked.
>
> What strikes me most is the misunderstanding of Field Theory. As
pointed
> out in another thread a tuned loop, air or ferrite, does effect the
local
> field for some distance greater than it's diameter and can be
partially
> absorbed in the windings. Any EM field has electrical and magnetic
> components, if they didn't generators wouldn't work nor would the
lowly
> transformer which takes electrical energy, converts it to magnetic
and
> back again. A loop antenna with a pickup winding can be treated as an
> unshielded transformer with it's primary excited by the EM that it's
> resonant with instead of an applied current. In a ferrite rod antenna
> neither the coil or the rod alone are the antenna, they interact with
each
> other to make the functioning whole in a predictable manner using
standard
> Field Theory .
>
> Doesn't matter if the duck is black or white, you can't tell just
from
> it's quack and both taste the same rubbed with sage and stuffed with
rice
> dressing after being baked at 350  ;)
>
> The idea that a ferrite rod 8" long is going to capture "photons" in
the
> MW band provoked an expletive that my Lady heard. She wondered if I
was
> shopping for fertilizer online...
>
> True, one of the fundamental ides of Quantum Mechanics is that
> Electromagnetic energy, radio frequencies or Gamma rays, behave like
waves
> sometimes and particles at other times. Design an experiment to
detect
> light as a particle and you'll find particles, an experiment to find
light
> waves will detect waves. In reality light is neither until it's
detected
> and it's probably something else entirely anyway. Light going through
a
> diffraction grating or properly sized dual slit behaves as if it were
> waves, in a photomultiplier tube or a larger dual slit it acts like
> particles.
>
> The problem with looking for particles (photons) at say 1000KHz is
that to
> detect a photon the detector has to be bigger than the photon. With
light
> that's easy, you can read this because the rods and cones in your
eyes
> undergo chemical reactions because they are much bigger than a photon
of
> light, unless your blind and using a reader but I think my point is
clear.
>
> If Mr. Grahm were using a ferrite rod 300 meters or longer I might
give
> some credibility to his "Photon interaction" ideas. Even at microwave
> frequencies where it would be practical I don't know of any practical
uses
> offhand.
>
> The Electron spin stuff? The magnetic fields within a ferrite rod
even in
> the strongest EM fields is nowhere near enough to flip an Electron.
Why do
> you think they need such gawdawful powerful magnets to do an MRI?
>
> I'd think spending more time looking into the properties of the
ferrite
> rods themselves would be more enlightening. The composition of the
mix,
> grain size, binding agent, how much pressure and what temperature was
used
> during forming all contribute to the rod's properties as much as it's
> physical dimensions. A 1/2" diameter rod 8" long may work best at ELF
or
> HF depending on the above factors. Using them outside their designed
> parameters in resonant circuits can cause unexpected results as I
have
> learned the hard way.
>
> One reason I prefer air core loops for DXing, air is the same at ELF
or
> SHF.
>
> Tim
>
> On 4/10/2011 9:20, tbaugh wrote:
>> Hello All
>>
>> Have been MW DXing&  SWL for 50+ years, so fit the profile it would
seem.
>> However I am late-to-the-table as far as this group is concerned,
having
>> just joined this year. This is my first post.
>>
>> Just recently, I have come across an explanation&  description of the
>> Ferrite Sleeve Loop Antenna. Always a sucker for a new antenna, this
>> concept
>> seems quite interesting although I don't have the background to
evaluate
>> this gentleman's claims. Nor just now, do I have enough cores to
>> duplicate
>> his work. However, I believe that he is based on the Emerald Isle,
so
>> that
>> should count for something, tic.
>>
>> Looking forward to comments on:
>> http://www.gmweb2.net/The%20FS%20Loop.htm
>>
>> Regards Terry

_______________________________________________
IRCA mailing list
IRCA@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
http://montreal.kotalampi.com/mailman/listinfo/irca

Opinions expressed in messages on this mailing list are those of the
original contributors and do not necessarily reflect the opinion of the
IRCA, its editors, publishing staff, or officers

For more information: http://www.ircaonline.org

To Post a message: irca@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx






_______________________________________________
IRCA mailing list
IRCA@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
http://montreal.kotalampi.com/mailman/listinfo/irca

Opinions expressed in messages on this mailing list are those of the original contributors and do not necessarily reflect the opinion of the IRCA, its editors, publishing staff, or officers

For more information: http://www.ircaonline.org

To Post a message: irca@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx